'I am simply not cut out to be a regular Hindi film heroine'
Haresh Pandya's interview with Shabana Azmi continues:
Is it true the Hindi films have played a silent role in the upliftment of working women in India?
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Shabana Azmi. Click for bigger pic!
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I think the working woman is singularly absent from the Hindi cinema because, in reality, a lot of women work, but in commercial cinema they don't seem to be doing any work at all. The commercial Hindi film heroine is a Miss Nita with not even a surname. She flits in and out of angry scenes with her boyfriend till finally they fall in love and get married.
It is very doubtful if she is a working woman. Even in a few instances where she is shown as a working woman, she is shown as working against her will. I think the Hindi mainstream cinema has not bothered to realise the strength of women except in the mother mould -- you see shades of it in Mother India and Deewar and stuff like that. A heroine is mostly a decorative piece in most films. It has been the parallel cinema which has given women more substantial roles to do. Definitely.
Do you believe in the number games for stars?
No. I'm sure these numbers work for a certain amount of time. But they are very transient, very temporary. Somebody who is No 1 today will slip from that position in three months -- the period that people reign as No 1 is getting reduced because you are considered as good as your last hit or last flop. That seems to be the order of the day.
What have you to say about the alleged nexus between Bollywood and the underworld, if the killing of Gulshan Kumar is anything to go by?
I take great offence to that question because it is a very sweeping question. It seems to suggest that you are fully aware that this is true. This has happened in one case. A minuscule proportion of people in the industry who may have dubious connections with the underworld... In which industry, I want to know, do they not exist?
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Click for bigger pic!
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The film industry doesn't exist outside our society. And our society today unfortunately has got degenerated to the point where no rights and wrongs exist on their own. But compromises are sought for money, compromises are sought for various lubrications of personal gain etc. And the fact is that the film industry is now reeling under this because the media has made it seem as if all of the film industry is involved.
What has made the underworld so important that even somebody from the film industry wants to go there. Firstly, it is the absence of institutional finance. No bank will give money to the film industry.
Because of this, people sometimes tend to take money from dubious channels. But where did the underworld get that money from? Were it not or complicity with politicians, would it have been possible for them to be as powerful as they have become? So the answer lies somewhere else.
It is the media which makes it seem as if the entire film industry is now financed by the underworld. Which is not true. That, again, is not to say that the film industry should not sit up and take notice of what it is doing. I think the film industry must also recognise that the kind of gossip that is written about it harms the industry's status.
Because when your stars are written about in such light terms, then the public also thinks, 'These people only have affairs and play with black money.' So the film industry has to make concerted effort to see that image-building is not left to gossip magazines. It's time the film industry also took stock of itself to see the areas in which it has gone so wrong to create a loophole like the Gulshan Kumar case into which everything else will fall.
Don't you think today's film-makers are busy making too many films, aiming at quantity rather than at quality?
It is not just their fault. It is a chicken and eggs situation. The film producer is in the business of films because s/he wants to make money. S/he is very clear about this. Now, what is our responsibility as audiences? If we are going to like Coolie No 1, then let me assure you that the producer will make 15 Coolie No1s. If we as audiences indicate that we want to make films about women's emancipation, or mythological films, or about social films, the producer will be very happy to make them too.
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Click for bigger pic!
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S/he is interested in making money. It is a business for her/him. It is very easy for us to say that the film industry makes rubbish. But then, why do we go to see those films. How can only those films succeed which have all those ingredients? Look at us, we have been working since 20 years, we have been sacrificing money, time, everything for those films. So many of these films do not even see the light of the day. And when they are shown in the theatre, people don't even go to watch. So it is also the audiences's responsibility, it is the responsibility of both -- of our society and of our producers.
Basically, I think that film appreciation must be started at school level because you need to appreciate good cinema and that is not taught to you. And suddenly, at 20, you expect that a boy who has never seen good cinema to suddenly start appreciating it. It can't happen. It has to be started at the school level.
But it is still considered taboo to talk about films at a certain age.
No longer, No longer. I think the infiltration of television has changed all that. Now you can't escape cinema anywhere, even in the villages. So I don't think it is true any longer that films are considered taboo. No, I don't.
What is the future of Hindi films?
I think they will continue to flourish. They will have some lows and some highs. But it's there to stay. There is nothing in the world that can really and truly finish the film industry. Far from it. I am absolutely confident of the future of Hindi films.
Do you think most of your directors have drawn good performances from you?
Yes. I think if at any given point you ever thought that there was a performance of mine which was good, Seventy per cent of that contribution came from directors. I am incapable of giving a good performance without a good director, without a good script backing and without good co-stars.
What is your biggest plus point as an actress?
My sincerity. I don't fool around with my work. I work very hard. And with every new film I am like a new student. I do not treat my work lightly.
The Shabana Azmi interview, continued
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